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Cutting up
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Cutting up - 02-25-2008, 07:40 PM

I know it is all about diet and I have that sorted. But as I am naturally very toned and burn fat well I have never tried any cutting/fat loss products ever (even legal to buy ones). I am doing a cycle of test c, deca, adrol now and I just plan to use a cutting supplement at the end of my cycle. I know all the products but I wanted to know peoples opinions on what they would rec. I was thinking of doing 2 weeks of clen at the end of my cycle. Just at a low dose and if I like that do other 2 weeks (after a 2 week break of course). But at the same time I don't want to use anything which will make my weight drop off. I am gonna do a HUGE order from Synthetek industries soon. I notice they have many cutting products so I was wondering what is the best. Maybe not the caffeine one though cos I don't want to use one that makes me 'wired'. There are loads like that with alsorts of herbs in and they make you sweat so much and I want to stay away from all of those. By the way I know clen will do that alittle but I have heard good things and 2 weeks isn't long. The usual protocol is 2 week on and 2 weeks off but I have heard it is effective for 4-6 weeks so I was thinking if I like it then 3 weeks at the end of my cycle. Let me know what you rec


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02-25-2008, 07:48 PM

I would suggest going with Clen 2wks on 2wks off stacked with Tyrone's ECA stack on the off weeks.....


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02-25-2008, 08:36 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by kawasaki1
I would suggest going with Clen 2wks on 2wks off stacked with Tyrone's ECA stack on the off weeks.....
I have about 6 days left of adrol. After I stop the adrol I plan doing 1 week or so of deca and 3 weeks or so of the test c. When would you rec I start your suggestion? If it hadn't arrived I could simply do one more week of test whilst I was waiting. I will do 2 weeks clen and 2 weeks ECA and repeat so 8 weeks in total. Would that be fine anytime of year incase I really like it? I wouldn't do it much cos like I said I am naturally very toned and it would drop the weight off too much if done too much.

I will have to change my workout time alittle cos I usually workout at about 9pm! On the ECA I will have trouble sleeping if taken just b4! I will PM Tyrone now then. Thanks


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Lightbulb 02-25-2008, 10:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elvia1023
I know it is all about diet and I have that sorted. But as I am naturally very toned and burn fat well I have never tried any cutting/fat loss products ever (even legal to buy ones). I am doing a cycle of test c, deca, adrol now and I just plan to use a cutting supplement at the end of my cycle. I know all the products but I wanted to know peoples opinions on what they would rec. I was thinking of doing 2 weeks of clen at the end of my cycle. Just at a low dose and if I like that do other 2 weeks (after a 2 week break of course). But at the same time I don't want to use anything which will make my weight drop off. I am gonna do a HUGE order from Synthetek industries soon. I notice they have many cutting products so I was wondering what is the best. Maybe not the caffeine one though cos I don't want to use one that makes me 'wired'. There are loads like that with alsorts of herbs in and they make you sweat so much and I want to stay away from all of those. By the way I know clen will do that alittle but I have heard good things and 2 weeks isn't long. The usual protocol is 2 week on and 2 weeks off but I have heard it is effective for 4-6 weeks so I was thinking if I like it then 3 weeks at the end of my cycle. Let me know what you rec

I would try running some CLEN and keep diet SUPER tight.
   
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02-25-2008, 11:18 PM

I though this might interest some people. I have found loads more but this covers important points. By the way I will still be doing the 2 weeks clen and 2 weeks ECA cos it sounds like a winning formula! I will just try both and see how I feel on each. Although clen sounds ideal because that reduces fat but can increase muscle.

"Since weīre speaking about beta-receptors and upregulation, here, let me address the claim that you can use ephedrine (or the ECA stack), alternating with clen, in order to avoid receptor downgrade. Iīm not sure where this rumor came from, but it is totally incorrect.

To dispel this myth, lets examine ephedrine for a second. Remember when I said that using clenbuterol to stimulate the beta-2 receptors is like hitting a tack with a hammer? Well, Ephedrine is like a sledge-hammer, it hits the beta-2īs and everything around them. Thatīs because itīs not selective, but rather it stimulates other receptors to a great degree as well.

Anyway, one of those receptors that ephedrine hits is the Beta-2 (yeah...the same one as Clen). As you can see from the graph below (ephedrine is represented by the the solid circles), it reduced Beta-2-AndrenergicReceptor (what we call, in laymens terms, the "Beta-2 receptor") levels to 32% of the control level after 24 hours. Read this again:

Ephedrine, in this study, reduces Beta-2 receptor levels to 32% of control after 24 hours.

(see the solid circles in this graph represent ephedrine)



Granted, itīs not perfect, itīs not in vivo, etc...But thereīs no denying that ephedrine will downregulate beta-2 receptors....ergo you will not be able to use it on the weeks in between your clen to upgrade your receptors."


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02-29-2008, 02:16 AM

I like to do a eq + primo mix, sometime I throw in winny too. In my experiance the eq helps prolong gains the best. Plus you will get hard as a rock and get nice and vascular. Which I think is the best look. I am so over the bulky bloated look. I like the thick rock solid look much better these days, even if I am alittle smaller I look ten times better and to me thats what its all about. Its all about look to me, and I think this end stack will do you justice.
   
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02-29-2008, 11:21 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gippywool
I like to do a eq + primo mix, sometime I throw in winny too. In my experiance the eq helps prolong gains the best. Plus you will get hard as a rock and get nice and vascular. Which I think is the best look. I am so over the bulky bloated look. I like the thick rock solid look much better these days, even if I am alittle smaller I look ten times better and to me thats what its all about. Its all about look to me, and I think this end stack will do you justice.
An order (not from a board sponsor) didn't come and it has been 5 months and no seizure letter. But I am made up cos I am able to pick new items. That because I mentioned my cycle has almost finished and I don't even want to use the original products now (adrol etc). So I have just thrown in loads of clen and some proviron.

I know what you mean about the bloated look. I still look cool but my face has just gone huge. I know it will go back to normal but really it would have been 10 weeks like that or so and that is 1/5 of the year. I am not too bothered but I am the sort of person who doesn't want people to think I am on gear (by appearance). I want them to think he is big but natural looking etc. But that increase in weight in my face has lead to about 10 comments of you must be on gear! Obviously I am much bigger too but it is the face that gets people thinking cos that doesn't happen if you eat alot for a few weeks or so. The bloat can be good if it is manageable and you remain lean in the right places. Thats why I will still be doing dbol etc.

My next cycle will be kickstart dbol, Sust and Eq. I think I will be cool on that and the bloat won't be so big. Plus I will be using armidex throughout. But after that one I will probably stick to the likes of tbol, anavar, primo, masteron, eq, test p, sust etc. Plus armidex during and proviron sometimes.

Looking forward to trying the clen cos it will keep me lean but the little bit of fat will be gone. Not gonan go huge in dose.. maybe 60 or 80mcg.

By the way I was on other forum and there was a thread on clen that was about 19 pages long. It started with a document on clen by one of the site moderators and most the stuff I had read before but some stuff was an interesting read. I think is name was partyboy who wrote it.

Is it right that you don't have to taper the dose down? Because I have always read you do. He said the usual go up gradually and not to exceed 7 tabs or so. But that you don't have to taper it down and can simply stop on the high dose. I know the usual protocol is 2 weeks on and 2 weeks off but I know it can be taken for longer (6 weeks or so). It maybe only be 4 weeks and it all depends upon body temperature etc. Because I feel I won't need many goes at it I am gonna just do 3 weeks of clen at the end of this cycle. I might do 2 weeks on and 2 weeks off X2 but I will decide once I start it.


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Last edited by Elvia1023; 02-29-2008 at 01:56 PM.
   
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whats up fellaz
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whats up fellaz - 02-29-2008, 01:33 PM

hey noticed you guys comments on some eq.. what do you think about going with just eq. start to finish??? not trying to do shows or anything.. just tryin to maintain a good hard body.. tried lots of other gear over the past few years from regular Tes. to Win and now looking into eq.. dont like to pump full of all kinds of stuff ya know.. I just go like 2 times a year to get those boosts and then maintain in the meantime.. what do you guys think of just a straight run of eq.. 20ml 250mg per ml.. in about 12 weeks??? 1-2 ml a week
lookin 4 heads up fellaz..
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03-01-2008, 02:18 AM

No way around it Kev, you and I both know if your gonna use high androgens your gonna hold water. I use to tell people the bloat was from creatine, but that will only go so far. The more natural look comes from the anabolics, but I know it is hard to kick the androgens completly. The size and strenth is a high alone that is the hardest to give up. I believe that you are the one who has to be satisfied when you look in the mirror. So whatever makes you happy...fuck it, get jacked up, baby! I can't wait to start been off for 6 months and I look like shit. Rupture a tendon in my hand and had surgery so the comeback has arrived. Just waiting for one item, been waiting for about 5 week too. My Anadrol, soon as I get that I will train 2 to 3 month clean then start to jack it up! I have a big show to go too in June alot of friends are entering so I have to help them train and I will be helping back stage for one. I am gonna show him the ole hair dryer trick. I am guessing you know this trick already, but if you don't I will share with you. Let me know.
   
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03-01-2008, 02:31 AM

BSTEELZ, In my experiance EQ is better used stack with something else. It makes whatever you stack with it work so much better. I think if you want to keep it simple you should stack it with primo. If you want to go alittle more I would say use EQ 200-400mgs, Primo 200-300mgs, and test prop 100mgs 3x's per week, whcih is a great safe and clean cycle. The only thing I never stack with EQ is deca, becase I use them both as a base for whatever stack I wish to put togather.Deca I use for bulking base, and Eq is my cutting base. I use the deca for bulking becase when you are lifting weights that your body naturally shouldn't be lifting the deca helps keep your joints strong and lubracated. Whereas EQ is cleaner and usually shrinks my waistline a great deal and keeps me full and vascular is the perfect base for cutting and hardening.
   
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03-01-2008, 10:15 AM

Bump gippywool. I understand you don't want to pump yourself with lots of compounds. But sometimes taking 2 carries the same sides as 1 etc. Plus I always think when you cycle you should try to get as much as possible from each cycle then lots of recovery time and make sure you fully recover before embarking upon other cycle. That doesn't mean I am rec 4 compounds etc... far from it. I just think doing the above is much better than just doing the Eq alone. Especially if you have experience of different componds then you could do 3 at a single time.

I would stick to a test p, eq cycle if you want it simple. If your worried about too many injections then you can mix the compounds or even do something like sust as the blend carries much less water weight than the likes of test c or e. My rec would be test p, eq and primo... all at fairly low doses (200-350mg per week).

It is true most usually do short ester componds together or long together. The above is a mixture but it would work well. I plan to do a "cutting" cycle later in the year. Although a short estered test would be best I am choosing a blend as that is still decent for a cutting cycle (contains test p etc anyway). I may even decide to change to test p and mast p.

Week 1-12= Sust at 350mg per week
Week 1-8= Anavar at 40mg per day
Week 1-11= Masteron E at 300mg per week
Week 8-14= Proviron at 25mg per day

Armidex on hand for throughout the cycle (if needed which it won't be as sust is the only compound that really goes through aromatization) Oh and masteron acts as a mild anti-estrogen so I should be cool. I will add pro to thre equation cos I love the feeling it gives and it will harden me up as will the anavar earlier on.

If I want to be more cut on this cycle then I will add a clen regime and maybe an ECA too. Probably just 3 weeks of clen or 2 week on 2weeks off X2. Maybe the following if I want to be cut extra

Week 9-10= Clen
Week 11-12= ECA
Week 13-14= Clen

PCT started at the end of last clen. PCT consisting of clomid and nolvadex for 3 weeks.

Week 15-18= PCT


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Last edited by Elvia1023; 03-01-2008 at 10:22 AM.
   
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thanks
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Thumbs up thanks - 03-01-2008, 01:36 PM

yeah i figured stackin with some test would be better than alone i just dont have the T available.. I have the eq so i figured i would go with what i got.. maybe ill wait a couple of weeks and try to get it together.. and you said Test P??? is that "propinate" ... spell??? or something else.. does it matter what kind of test.. cause ive used the T-enanthate i believe its called and the cyponate ??? which do you think is the best or does it not really matter..

thanks for the headz up..
   
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03-01-2008, 02:09 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by bsteelz
yeah i figured stackin with some test would be better than alone i just dont have the T available.. I have the eq so i figured i would go with what i got.. maybe ill wait a couple of weeks and try to get it together.. and you said Test P??? is that "propinate" ... spell??? or something else.. does it matter what kind of test.. cause ive used the T-enanthate i believe its called and the cyponate ??? which do you think is the best or does it not really matter..

thanks for the headz up..
Yes it is test propionate. You should be using that one for a cutting cycle. It has a very short active life so you would need to inject eod. Sust is usually used for bulking cycles but it can be used for cutting ones too. That is a blend of 5 tests (including test p). I would inject sust two times per week.

Don't take test c or e if you want to cut. Sure you can uf you use a good anti-e or other hardening agents. But they carry much more water weight than the 2 above. They are basically the same but I would say test c has a bit more of a kick.

Just order some test and the extras from a board sponsor. And my best advice would be to wait until you actually get it before starting the cycle. Even if it takes 4 weeks... just wait cos it will be worth it. I would throw in some clen too to be taken near the end of the cycle. It's only $20 for 100 tabs!


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thanks
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Thumbs up thanks - 03-01-2008, 09:08 PM

good look Elv! i appreciate it.. ill do that..
   
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03-03-2008, 02:38 PM

You are absolutly right I am not disagreeing with you at all, but I do use alot of compounds I just don't use alot of high test anymore. No more then 750mgs to 1000mgs per week split between oral and injectable, which for some may still be considered alot....but I did use to do double that amount years ago, I am never going to say I don't want size because that would be just silly. I want size with the hardness, because I think it is a better look. You know what I mean. Shit, this time around I going with Sus, Deca, and anadrol...then switch to EQ, Primo, tren150. Plus it is hard for me to give advice to people because I don't know how far they want to go with this. I try to be as smart as I can and take tips from experianced people all over to see what imput they might have, but in the end I have to say I am an addict too, and I will go to any extreme where some people are limited or scared. By the way I got what I was waiting for today....Ivitamins rules!

Last edited by gippywool; 03-03-2008 at 04:25 PM.
   
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03-03-2008, 04:41 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gippywool
You are absolutly right I am not disagreeing with you at all, but I do use alot of compounds I just don't use alot of high test anymore. No more then 750mgs to 1000mgs per week split between oral and injectable, which for some may still be considered alot....but I did use to do double that amount years ago, I am never going to say I don't want size because that would be just silly. I want size with the hardness, because I think it is a better look. You know what I mean. Shit, this time around I going with Sus, Deca, and anadrol...then switch to EQ, Primo, tren150. Plus it is hard for me to give advice to people because I don't know how far they want to go with this. I try to be as smart as I can and take tips from experianced people all over to see what imput they might have, but in the end I have to say I am an addict too, and I will go to any extreme where some people are limited or scared. By the way I got what I was waiting for today....Ivitamins rules!
Glad to hear you got your stuff gippywool. And your cycle sounds great. I am actually doing the same but test c instead of sust. Just curious but if your doing those 3 I gather you must be doing them for atleast 10 weeks (sust and deca). So if your doing the other three after that how long will your cycle last? Are you doing a 20 week cycle? My current one will be about 15 weeks of test and 13 of deca by the end of it. I think that is the longest I will ever go. Gonna just stick to 12-14 weeks in the future. Oh and your right about the super doses. The most I am ever gonna do is 750mg per week of test. My next cycle will be more like 500mg of test and 300mg of masteron or eq.


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03-04-2008, 02:24 AM

Yes 20 weeks, question...are you holding alot of water with those anadrol? I know you are using test c too might be hard to tell. I just don't want to blow up too much where it is too obvious. I might start with a half a tab a day to see where it goes. My diet will be very strict too, so we will see. Back to the gym tomorrow after 6 month dealing with a injury.
   
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03-04-2008, 10:41 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by gippywool
Yes 20 weeks, question...are you holding alot of water with those anadrol? I know you are using test c too might be hard to tell. I just don't want to blow up too much where it is too obvious. I might start with a half a tab a day to see where it goes. My diet will be very strict too, so we will see. Back to the gym tomorrow after 6 month dealing with a injury.
It's strange cos I done the test c and deca for 6 weeks (b4 getting the adrol) and barely gained! I can't understand why (my diet has been the same the whole way through till now). I am always usually toned but I had fat around my stomach area etc. I was even taking 10mg of nolva per day just to help combat the water weight etc. Anyway when I got my proviron I noticed in days me hardening up and I was made up.

Now to answer your question when I started the anadrol at 50mg per day (not split and just taken 1 hour b4 the gym) I gained huge amounts of weight. But although the majority of it must be water weight (cos 11 pounds in the first 5 days!) I was made up with the look it gave me. I didn't have fatty deposits and although I was obviously not as toned as 7 weeks prior I was still lean in all the right places. I will be able to tell you better when I finish my cycle. My last adrol tab was taken yesterday. You don't have to taper the dose but I just finished with 25mg per day the last few days.

It would make sense to split the 50mg dose into am/pm. I tried both and surprisingly preferred the one tab about 1 hour before the gym. I think you will be cool cos you are doing Sust and that is no so bad for water weight. In future cycles I am gonna leave out anti-e during unless needed. I might do armidex occasionally. Of course the adrol added to my water weight but I would say most of it is down to the test c. I would have expected it to be the other way. You know about the sides I mentioned and thats why I will be doing dbol instead for future cycles. They are not that bad but with dbol I feel great so no contest. I will try other brand of adrol sometime but I think I am gonna mainyl use tbol, anavar and dbol in future cycles for orals.

So you should be cool. If your like me you will love it and hate it at the same time! Just cause it really did wipe me out and besides when in the gym I was happy to not really do much and just lay about (not like me). So expect huge increases and obviously water weight but I think you will be happy. My one rec is definately proviron. Even at just 25mg per day to help harden you up whilst you are taking the adrol. If you done 25mg of pro am/pm you would really notice a difference. I imagine you are kickstarting with adrol so start the pro in week 2 or 3 so you realize the difference it makes.

I am looking forward to my PCT cos my moonface as it has been called by my ex gf will finally be gone!


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03-04-2008, 10:51 AM

Gippywool I should say although good gains can be made with 25mg of adrol I really think you need to be doing 50mg. It's cool if you wanna start on 25 for the first 2 days or so then go up. It doesn't bind to your receptors like other orals. It is much less efficient in that respect so thats why larger doses are needed. So taking 50mg of adrol is not like 50mg of dbol. If you go on any sites they say the average dose is 50-150mg. Some do more but there really is no point. That is common with people doing super doses though and more for the mental than the physical. The difference between 50 and 100 is huge and 100 and 150 is great too. But doing 200 compared to 150 has been tested many times and the isn't a huge difference at all and just alot more sides.

Anyway went abit off track then! Just mean if your gonna do it I would do 50mg per day cos that is a nice amount and shouldn't carry many sides. But if your worried about going huge not really the best choice of compound! But your 2nd half wil sort that out plus your diet as you mention and all the hard work. Your cycle should be great so no need to say goodluck.


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03-04-2008, 12:16 PM

Thanks!
   
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