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Sub Q tren experience
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Sub Q tren experience - 06-10-2013, 04:31 PM

I have been asked this question a bunch of times lately so I figured my .02 could help a few of u

As some of you may know I am a big tren acetate lover BUT over the years I developped scar tissues that made it a pain in the ass for the frequent injections . Also areas with scar tissues for some reasons were more prone to give me the tren cough whenever I injected in it .

I could have switched to tren enanthate but for some reasons I like tren ace better

So I decided to give Sub Q tren a shot

It came out to be a pretty good idea ... so my advice is go ahead but dont shoot more than 0.25mls per area . Also dont forget the massage for a good 1 minute on each site you injected in . This will avoid the bump you get the day after from injecting an oil SQ.

Just be aware that absorption SQ is supposed to be a bit slower than IM BUT it does work, no tren cough and easier on the pinning so it is cool in my book

Just wanted to share my experience




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06-10-2013, 06:13 PM

I do.5cc with 27gx1/2 with no problems. If I feel a knot forming, I just use a hot water bottle on it. It's important that you don't do a subQ in place of IM, if that's how you've been pinning. Like mike1107 said, it's slower absorption, so it will throw off your levels.
   
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06-10-2013, 06:39 PM

Thanks for sharing Mike. You mentioned not going over .25mls per area. In your experience, what did the higher volumes do to you? Longer dissipation time for the lump? Irritation? Cough?
   
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06-10-2013, 06:46 PM

Less chance for cough since you're doing it SC and there are fewer veins to nick.
   
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06-10-2013, 06:55 PM

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Originally Posted by Magnus82 View Post
Thanks for sharing Mike. You mentioned not going over .25mls per area. In your experience, what did the higher volumes do to you? Longer dissipation time for the lump? Irritation? Cough?
Big ass lump and irritation

IMO anything over 0.5ml per site (when it comes to oily products) is too much
0.25ml was good for me ... but everybody is different so I guess some people can handle a bigger injection volume better




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06-11-2013, 06:20 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by hijacked View Post
I know the absorption is slower, but does anyone know how much slower? Did you do anything to compensate for this?
the common thing I heard was it was 30% slower than IM

didnt get any scientifical data to prove it but in my experience it semt accurate

I didnt do anything to compensate




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06-11-2013, 07:56 AM

I'm on the Sub Q train also. After 20 years of pinning with an 1 1/2" I was relieved to find I could subQ anything. I tend to use my quads just for convenience. I also Like The Ace much better than enanthate or Hex. Even Pinning my homebrew at .5 ml is Ok. A little redness but thats it.
   
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06-11-2013, 08:07 AM

I found this when I was researching Sub Q as opposed to IM. I also notice that when I shoot My CJC with Dac into a fatty area I feel flush within 10 minutes. and the same goes for melanotan. But my guess is that because those are water based it just happens much quicker.

Disposition and Fate of Drugs: Pharmacology Introduction: Merck Veterinary Manual

Drug Absorption from Parenteral Delivery Sites
After a drug has penetrated the skin, GI epithelium, or other absorbing surface, or has been deposited by injection into a body tissue, it comes into the immediate vicinity of capillaries. Solutes traverse the capillary wall by a combination of 2 processes: diffusion and filtration. Diffusion is the pre***inant mode of transfer for lipid-soluble molecules, small lipid-insoluble molecules, and ions. Because most capillaries are fenestrated, all drugs, whether lipid-soluble or not, cross the capillary wall at rates that are extremely rapid compared with their rates across other body membranes. In fact, the movement of most drug molecules in various tissues is limited only by the rate of blood flow rather than by the capillary wall. However, some endothelial cells, such as the blood-brain barrier, have much tighter intercellular junctions than others and, therefore, restrict drug movement more significantly.

Aqueous solutions of drugs are usually absorbed from an IM injection site within 10–30 min, provided blood flow is unimpaired. Faster or slower absorption is possible, depending on the concentration and lipid solubility of the drug, vascularity of the site (there are differences between various muscle groups), the volume of injection, the osmolality of the solution, and other pharmaceutical factors. Substances with molecular weights >20,000 daltons are principally taken up into the lymphatics.

Absorption of drugs from subcutaneous tissues is influenced by the same factors that determine the rate of absorption from IM sites. Some drugs are absorbed as rapidly from subcutaneous tissues as from muscle, although absorption from injection sites in subcutaneous fat is always significantly delayed.

Increasing blood supply to the injection site by heating, massage, or exercise hastens the rate of dissemination and absorption. Spreading and absorption of a large fluid volume that has been injected SC may be facilitated by including hyaluronidase in the solution.


The rate of absorption of an injected drug may be prolonged in a number of ways, including immobilization of the site, local cooling, a tourniquet, incorporation of a vasoconstrictor, an oil base, and implant pellets and insoluble “depot” preparations. Among these depot preparations are drugs that are converted to less soluble salts (eg, procaine and benzathine esters of penicillin or acetate esters of steroids) or less soluble complexes (eg, protamine zinc insulin), or that are administered as insoluble micro-crystalline suspensions (eg, methylprednisolone acetate).
   
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06-11-2013, 09:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBob View Post
I'm on the Sub Q train also. After 20 years of pinning with an 1 1/2" I was relieved to find I could subQ anything. I tend to use my quads just for convenience. I also Like The Ace much better than enanthate or Hex. Even Pinning my homebrew at .5 ml is Ok. A little redness but thats it.
you using your quads for SQ ? I know it can be done but never did it

how does it feel ? I mean any discomfort ?




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06-11-2013, 01:24 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike1107 View Post
you using your quads for SQ ? I know it can be done but never did it

how does it feel ? I mean any discomfort ?
No Mike, no discomfort. There was some sting with endosyns cutabolic but maybe too much BA? I use it now for 20mg prop injects daily. Even my own tren ace brew doesn't hurt. Little lumpy if I don't get in right but that's it.
   
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06-11-2013, 04:07 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBob View Post
No Mike, no discomfort. There was some sting with endosyns cutabolic but maybe too much BA? I use it now for 20mg prop injects daily. Even my own tren ace brew doesn't hurt. Little lumpy if I don't get in right but that's it.
ok now Ill have to give it a try tonight




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Last edited by mike1107; 06-11-2013 at 04:10 PM.
   
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06-12-2013, 03:23 AM

I do my TRT this way and was wondering about adding tren in subQ or even doing short blasts in the 500-700mg/wk of prop with up to 100mg a day. Thanks for sharing your experience with tren subQ.
   
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06-13-2013, 12:09 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBob View Post
I found this when I was researching Sub Q as opposed to IM. I also notice that when I shoot My CJC with Dac into a fatty area I feel flush within 10 minutes. and the same goes for melanotan. But my guess is that because those are water based it just happens much quicker.

Disposition and Fate of*Drugs: Pharmacology Introduction: Merck Veterinary Manual

Drug Absorption from Parenteral Delivery Sites
After a drug has penetrated the skin, GI epithelium, or other absorbing surface, or has been deposited by injection into a body tissue, it comes into the immediate vicinity of capillaries. Solutes traverse the capillary wall by a combination of 2 processes: diffusion and filtration. Diffusion is the pre***inant mode of transfer for lipid-soluble molecules, small lipid-insoluble molecules, and ions. Because most capillaries are fenestrated, all drugs, whether lipid-soluble or not, cross the capillary wall at rates that are extremely rapid compared with their rates across other body membranes. In fact, the movement of most drug molecules in various tissues is limited only by the rate of blood flow rather than by the capillary wall. However, some endothelial cells, such as the blood-brain barrier, have much tighter intercellular junctions than others and, therefore, restrict drug movement more significantly.

Aqueous solutions of drugs are usually absorbed from an IM injection site within 10–30 min, provided blood flow is unimpaired. Faster or slower absorption is possible, depending on the concentration and lipid solubility of the drug, vascularity of the site (there are differences between various muscle groups), the volume of injection, the osmolality of the solution, and other pharmaceutical factors. Substances with molecular weights >20,000 daltons are principally taken up into the lymphatics.

Absorption of drugs from subcutaneous tissues is influenced by the same factors that determine the rate of absorption from IM sites. Some drugs are absorbed as rapidly from subcutaneous tissues as from muscle, although absorption from injection sites in subcutaneous fat is always significantly delayed.

Increasing blood supply to the injection site by heating, massage, or exercise hastens the rate of dissemination and absorption. Spreading and absorption of a large fluid volume that has been injected SC may be facilitated by including hyaluronidase in the solution.


The rate of absorption of an injected drug may be prolonged in a number of ways, including immobilization of the site, local cooling, a tourniquet, incorporation of a vasoconstrictor, an oil base, and implant pellets and insoluble “depot” preparations. Among these depot preparations are drugs that are converted to less soluble salts (eg, procaine and benzathine esters of penicillin or acetate esters of steroids) or less soluble complexes (eg, protamine zinc insulin), or that are administered as insoluble micro-crystalline suspensions (eg, methylprednisolone acetate).
Good info. Thanks!
   
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Thanks, Mike.
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Thanks, Mike. - 06-19-2013, 10:35 PM

When my friend uses Tren, he uses Tren Enanthate because he hates frequent injections.

He will now try what you are suggesting. Thank you.
   
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06-19-2013, 10:57 PM

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Originally Posted by mike1107 View Post
ok now Ill have to give it a try tonight
Hey Mike, how did subq go in the quad go? Better than the ab***en, and if so do you think you could do a higher volume?
   
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Lightbulb 06-20-2013, 12:46 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBob View Post
I found this when I was researching Sub Q as opposed to IM. I also notice that when I shoot My CJC with Dac into a fatty area I feel flush within 10 minutes. and the same goes for melanotan. But my guess is that because those are water based it just happens much quicker.

Disposition and Fate of*Drugs: Pharmacology Introduction: Merck Veterinary Manual

Drug Absorption from Parenteral Delivery Sites
After a drug has penetrated the skin, GI epithelium, or other absorbing surface, or has been deposited by injection into a body tissue, it comes into the immediate vicinity of capillaries. Solutes traverse the capillary wall by a combination of 2 processes: diffusion and filtration. Diffusion is the pre***inant mode of transfer for lipid-soluble molecules, small lipid-insoluble molecules, and ions. Because most capillaries are fenestrated, all drugs, whether lipid-soluble or not, cross the capillary wall at rates that are extremely rapid compared with their rates across other body membranes. In fact, the movement of most drug molecules in various tissues is limited only by the rate of blood flow rather than by the capillary wall. However, some endothelial cells, such as the blood-brain barrier, have much tighter intercellular junctions than others and, therefore, restrict drug movement more significantly.

Aqueous solutions of drugs are usually absorbed from an IM injection site within 10–30 min, provided blood flow is unimpaired. Faster or slower absorption is possible, depending on the concentration and lipid solubility of the drug, vascularity of the site (there are differences between various muscle groups), the volume of injection, the osmolality of the solution, and other pharmaceutical factors. Substances with molecular weights >20,000 daltons are principally taken up into the lymphatics.

Absorption of drugs from subcutaneous tissues is influenced by the same factors that determine the rate of absorption from IM sites. Some drugs are absorbed as rapidly from subcutaneous tissues as from muscle, although absorption from injection sites in subcutaneous fat is always significantly delayed.

Increasing blood supply to the injection site by heating, massage, or exercise hastens the rate of dissemination and absorption. Spreading and absorption of a large fluid volume that has been injected SC may be facilitated by including hyaluronidase in the solution.


The rate of absorption of an injected drug may be prolonged in a number of ways, including immobilization of the site, local cooling, a tourniquet, incorporation of a vasoconstrictor, an oil base, and implant pellets and insoluble “depot” preparations. Among these depot preparations are drugs that are converted to less soluble salts (eg, procaine and benzathine esters of penicillin or acetate esters of steroids) or less soluble complexes (eg, protamine zinc insulin), or that are administered as insoluble micro-crystalline suspensions (eg, methylprednisolone acetate).
Vety interesting read. We still do ours IM but I'm open for change if its effective.
   
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