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Difference between subq and intermuscular for TRT?
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Difference between subq and intermuscular for TRT? - 02-16-2018, 12:46 PM

Recently I was told my buddies doctor tells him to taske his TRT dose sub q cause it absorbs faster in fat and keeps more stable blood levels than doing it intermuscular. Has anybody done both ways and gotten blood work done to compare the two? I would think 1ml subq which is 100iu is alot to do subq and that's why they do intermuscular? Any feedback is much appreciated.

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02-16-2018, 03:43 PM

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Originally Posted by jimmy14 View Post
Recently I was told my buddies doctor tells him to taske his TRT dose sub q cause it absorbs faster in fat and keeps more stable blood levels than doing it intermuscular. Has anybody done both ways and gotten blood work done to compare the two? I would think 1ml subq which is 100iu is alot to do subq and that's why they do intermuscular? Any feedback is much appreciated.

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I tried both ways and I personally didn't have a difference in my numbers. This was the same dose every 4th day and yes the oil left a knot sub q. You will see some guys say its not sub q but shallow IM etc.

I'm trying a small amount per Emeric's recommendation everyday sub q now and plan to get blood in about 2 more weeks to see if my free test is higher with the daily shots
   
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02-16-2018, 04:05 PM

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Originally Posted by kevin666 View Post
I tried both ways and I personally didn't have a difference in my numbers. This was the same dose every 4th day and yes the oil left a knot sub q. You will see some guys say its not sub q but shallow IM etc.

I'm trying a small amount per Emeric's recommendation everyday sub q now and plan to get blood in about 2 more weeks to see if my free test is higher with the daily shots
Im gona hop on the sub q also.i already do im 3 or 4 times a week using slin needle anyway.then get my bloods done.mainly to see what effect if any on my estro
   
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02-16-2018, 04:08 PM

Ya my body doctor did say if it's subq have to do more frequent shots cause it absorbs quicker. I'm gunna try on my cruise and get some blood work see what happens. Thanks for the info

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02-16-2018, 04:18 PM

I thought you were not supposed to do Subq with slin needle because it can cause infection? Is that just bro science?
   
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02-16-2018, 04:22 PM

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Originally Posted by docholiday08 View Post
I thought you were not supposed to do Subq with slin needle because it can cause infection? Is that just bro science?
Na I never heard nothing like that maybe if the testosterone in vial wasn't sterile or the pin your using

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02-16-2018, 04:43 PM

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Originally Posted by jimmy14 View Post
Na I never heard nothing like that maybe if the testosterone in vial wasn't sterile or the pin your using

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Wonder when and where I heard that lol. I think it was back when I watched that Tony Huge guy on youtube

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02-16-2018, 05:39 PM

I still inject my AAS IM. Sometimes when I do them truly subQ I get bruises or welts.
   
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02-17-2018, 10:06 AM

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Originally Posted by ASHOP View Post
I still inject my AAS IM. Sometimes when I do them truly subQ I get bruises or welts.
Ya I heard depends how much you inject I'm assuming that's why TRT doctors suggest subq well that's not the only reason. My buddy told me if he does anything over .5 he will get welts it's just to much oil to inject subq

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02-17-2018, 11:36 AM

Goes against everything I've ever read or discussed about onset. IM has always been known to "peak quicker.

With Subcutaneous it has to enter small vessels in your fat before reaching circulation. It causes lower peaks and generally (if you're doing E3D or EOD) very stable levels of T in your system, which keeps your E2 down.

But either way of administration if you inject often enough....T levels are very steady.

In either case, absorption is 100%.

Personally I don't like the lumps left from subq. I've been doing about 12mg of test daily IM with slin pins for awhile now.

Keeping stable levels when using TRT in my opinion is the best way to keep E2 and SHBG in range along with the proper dose of course. I have never had to use an AI while doing this.

But I'm an older guy...so what do I know? Theories and methods are always changing.

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02-17-2018, 11:52 AM

Coming up soon will be my first bloodwork with the small daily IM injections.

I'm hoping to eliminate the AI completely. I haven't been taking it so I'll see where my E2 is without it and hopefully see some increase in free test as well.

I can say that I do feel better in general though vs. a shot every 4th day, could be psychological so interested to see the bloodwork.
   
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02-17-2018, 12:34 PM

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Originally Posted by rmtt View Post
Goes against everything I've ever read or discussed about onset. IM has always been known to "peak quicker.

With Subcutaneous it has to enter small vessels in your fat before reaching circulation. It causes lower peaks and generally (if you're doing E3D or EOD) very stable levels of T in your system, which keeps your E2 down.

But either way of administration if you inject often enough....T levels are very steady.

In either case, absorption is 100%.

Personally I don't like the lumps left from subq. I've been doing about 12mg of test daily IM with slin pins for awhile now.

Keeping stable levels when using TRT in my opinion is the best way to keep E2 and SHBG in range along with the proper dose of course. I have never had to use an AI while doing this.

But I'm an older guy...so what do I know? Theories and methods are always changing.

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Do you blast or just use TRT dose year round? If you blast what's your protocol with test say long ester like cyp or E do you inject 2 times a week, E3D, EOD, ED?

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02-17-2018, 12:49 PM

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Originally Posted by jimmy14 View Post
Do you blast or just use TRT dose year round? If you blast what's your protocol with test say long ester like cyp or E do you inject 2 times a week, E3D, EOD, ED?

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I typically blast maybe twice a year. I add a faster acting test like TPP or TP...and add a mild compound like NPP to it. I keep my longer ester in....and I typically blast for about 8 weeks....then drop everything except the TRT dose of course.

My blasts are mild. I'm typically doing about 200mg total test and 200 mg NPP weekly. But I pin them everyday. I've ran other stuff back in the day....but more concerned with health now. Never done orals at all. I've always responded well to lower doses...diet is key to everything.

I do plan to try out Primo for the first time here pretty soon. Going to see if I can bump my test up to about 200-250.....and add Primo in at about 300mg a week.

Since Primo has been shown to lower estrogen.....I'm going to see if it will offset the increased test dose as I don't want to use AI's due to lipid impact.

As long as I can keep my estrogen under control...and find a decent total and free test number....I will run this one longer as they are both long esters.

Of course this all depends on how bloodwork looks while on.

I have a good relationship with my Dr....and he knows everything I do. Only compound I ever had issues with was Tren. I have naturally high HDL levels...and even a low dose of tren a for 8 weeks tanked them. So I gave it up awhile ago.

Npp is a good alternative to tren.....I just don't like some of the reports showing arterial damage.

That's why I'm trying Primo next. It's mild and takes awhile to see progress....but I got time!

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02-17-2018, 12:53 PM

Plus I've always been a fan of ed injects. The more stable the blood levels...the less sides you see.


In my opinion of course.

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02-17-2018, 01:11 PM

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I typically blast maybe twice a year. I add a faster acting test like TPP or TP...and add a mild compound like NPP to it. I keep my longer ester in....and I typically blast for about 8 weeks....then drop everything except the TRT dose of course.

My blasts are mild. I'm typically doing about 200mg total test and 200 mg NPP weekly. But I pin them everyday. I've ran other stuff back in the day....but more concerned with health now. Never done orals at all. I've always responded well to lower doses...diet is key to everything.

I do plan to try out Primo for the first time here pretty soon. Going to see if I can bump my test up to about 200-250.....and add Primo in at about 300mg a week.

Since Primo has been shown to lower estrogen.....I'm going to see if it will offset the increased test dose as I don't want to use AI's due to lipid impact.

As long as I can keep my estrogen under control...and find a decent total and free test number....I will run this one longer as they are both long esters.

Of course this all depends on how bloodwork looks while on.

I have a good relationship with my Dr....and he knows everything I do. Only compound I ever had issues with was Tren. I have naturally high HDL levels...and even a low dose of tren a for 8 weeks tanked them. So I gave it up awhile ago.

Npp is a good alternative to tren.....I just don't like some of the reports showing arterial damage.

That's why I'm trying Primo next. It's mild and takes awhile to see progress....but I got time!

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Ya I never tried primo just to expensive for me cause I was told to see the full benifets it should be ran at high dose like minimum 500mg week and if it comes in 100mg per ML it can get expensive but like what u were saying you respond well to low doses which every body is different. I seen better results when my test is low and other compounds higher to let them do the work and I'm gyno prone which sucks took me forever to find a dose of aromasin to keep my e2 under control it's a roller coaster. I'm in same boat I'm getting older and since I'm going to cycle regardless I want to do it as safe as possible. Ive been recently going to the doctor and I wasn't aware of the damage I was doing to myself because my lack of knowledge cycling AAS there is alot that goes into it you really gotta know what your doing to see the full benifets and keep yourself safe depends what compounds your taking but like you said blood work is the key if you don't get it you don't know what's going on cause I felt great but I was fucked up liver enzymes through the roof, thick blood, inlarged prostate, low e2. Sorry for long response I'm still learning everyday I do alot of search and reading. So what your saying is more frequent test shots will give stable levels and in return will keep your e2 in check? I'm asking cause I have problems keeping e2 in check it goes up and down I can't keep it stable but only for a little bit. I know you need to know my history to give advice that would work.

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02-17-2018, 03:06 PM

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Originally Posted by jimmy14 View Post
Ya I never tried primo just to expensive for me cause I was told to see the full benifets it should be ran at high dose like minimum 500mg week and if it comes in 100mg per ML it can get expensive but like what u were saying you respond well to low doses which every body is different. I seen better results when my test is low and other compounds higher to let them do the work and I'm gyno prone which sucks took me forever to find a dose of aromasin to keep my e2 under control it's a roller coaster. I'm in same boat I'm getting older and since I'm going to cycle regardless I want to do it as safe as possible. Ive been recently going to the doctor and I wasn't aware of the damage I was doing to myself because my lack of knowledge cycling AAS there is alot that goes into it you really gotta know what your doing to see the full benifets and keep yourself safe depends what compounds your taking but like you said blood work is the key if you don't get it you don't know what's going on cause I felt great but I was fucked up liver enzymes through the roof, thick blood, inlarged prostate, low e2. Sorry for long response I'm still learning everyday I do alot of search and reading. So what your saying is more frequent test shots will give stable levels and in return will keep your e2 in check? I'm asking cause I have problems keeping e2 in check it goes up and down I can't keep it stable but only for a little bit. I know you need to know my history to give advice that would work.

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I'm not sure if you've heard of Emeric Delzig.....But he is a big advocate of smaller ed injections of test. He says that even as little as 10mg daily will put your total test in the high normal range....but most importantly it keeps SHBG in check which allows for higer free test numbers which is good. It also keeps E2 levels in check.

Honestly...you rarely find a doc that prescribes an AI at true TRT doses as most of the time, they aren't needed. Only when raising the dose do things start to fall apart.

You can look him up and his protocol and decide for yourself.

As for the Primo....I've always heard the same thing about dosing. But I look at it this way....if it's going into your body....it will affect it. You may need the higher dose to see visual results quickly....but I'm pretty sure just 300mg will make an impact....it just may take longer to show.

At that dose....it becomes more economical. Now I wouldn't use it as a mass building drug....there are far more things out there better and cheaper....but everything comes with a price.

I'm planning to use it for its positive nitrogen benefits as I will slowly be reducing calories....plus I hear the well-being feeling you get from it is great.

If I were you, I would do ed injects, lower your test, and get bloodwork to see what your levels are at about 5-6 weeks in. You can then adjust up or down from there.

Also its a good thing to donate blood. I go every 60 days...or whenever it's due....and have never had high hemotocrit or hemoglobin levels.

Hope this helps.

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02-17-2018, 03:32 PM

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I'm not sure if you've heard of Emeric Delzig.....But he is a big advocate of smaller ed injections of test. He says that even as little as 10mg daily will put your total test in the high normal range....but most importantly it keeps SHBG in check which allows for higer free test numbers which is good. It also keeps E2 levels in check.

Honestly...you rarely find a doc that prescribes an AI at true TRT doses as most of the time, they aren't needed. Only when raising the dose do things start to fall apart.

You can look him up and his protocol and decide for yourself.

As for the Primo....I've always heard the same thing about dosing. But I look at it this way....if it's going into your body....it will affect it. You may need the higher dose to see visual results quickly....but I'm pretty sure just 300mg will make an impact....it just may take longer to show.

At that dose....it becomes more economical. Now I wouldn't use it as a mass building drug....there are far more things out there better and cheaper....but everything comes with a price.

I'm planning to use it for its positive nitrogen benefits as I will slowly be reducing calories....plus I hear the well-being feeling you get from it is great.

If I were you, I would do ed injects, lower your test, and get bloodwork to see what your levels are at about 5-6 weeks in. You can then adjust up or down from there.

Also its a good thing to donate blood. I go every 60 days...or whenever it's due....and have never had high hemotocrit or hemoglobin levels.

Hope this helps.

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Ya you seem pretty knowledgible I actually started my cycle today doing a sponser cycle tgat I'm logging on another forum.
Test e 500mg which I think I'm going to lower just wanted to keep it at that dose to see where leverls come back. Tren a and Injectible drol which I think was a bad move cause of my gyno I'm just asking for problems I do have pharma aromasin. Not starting drol and tren for couple more weeks. My issue is injecting everything and drol has to be ED so I think I might try ED injections to keep levels stable like you said and see what happens. Thanks for your feedback I'm gunna research emeric. Good luck with primo interested in hearing how it goes

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02-17-2018, 04:57 PM

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Originally Posted by jimmy14 View Post
Ya you seem pretty knowledgible I actually started my cycle today doing a sponser cycle tgat I'm logging on another forum.
Test e 500mg which I think I'm going to lower just wanted to keep it at that dose to see where leverls come back. Tren a and Injectible drol which I think was a bad move cause of my gyno I'm just asking for problems I do have pharma aromasin. Not starting drol and tren for couple more weeks. My issue is injecting everything and drol has to be ED so I think I might try ED injections to keep levels stable like you said and see what happens. Thanks for your feedback I'm gunna research emeric. Good luck with primo interested in hearing how it goes

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Good luck man.....an AI will help with the Test if estrogen becomes a problem.....but remember that Tren can cause prolactin/progesterone issues...and your typical AI won't cut it. You would need Caber or Prami for that.

Tren and Adrol is going to be pretty intense and hard on your body.

This is just my opinion....but you could attain pretty much the same results from Test, NPP, and using Tbol in replace of the adrol.

Plus when I used to use Tren....I couldn't gain weight on it. It transformed me, but best I could do was maintain bodyweight. That with eating a huge amount.

Would be less bloat in that as well plus a whole lot easier on your body.

If you haven't figured out by now...I'm more of an advocate for getting more with less....and making sure the things you do now dont bite you later in life. Just think of me as being here to offer "fatherly" advice. I'm 44 years old....and seen way too many ruin there life doing things without knoing what is going on in your body.

That's why I recommend getting bloodwork during your cycle. You know what your bloodwork looks like after you've come off...and cleaned things up....but that's not when most of the damage is being done.

I'm a big believer in TRT for life at the proper dose....along with a small amount of gh (2-3iu's) for anti-aging purposes......and occasional blasts where you get in and get out quickly are of the most beneficial/least impactfull for your body and health.

Keep us updated!

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02-18-2018, 10:57 AM

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Good luck man.....an AI will help with the Test if estrogen becomes a problem.....but remember that Tren can cause prolactin/progesterone issues...and your typical AI won't cut it. You would need Caber or Prami for that.

Tren and Adrol is going to be pretty intense and hard on your body.

This is just my opinion....but you could attain pretty much the same results from Test, NPP, and using Tbol in replace of the adrol.

Plus when I used to use Tren....I couldn't gain weight on it. It transformed me, but best I could do was maintain bodyweight. That with eating a huge amount.

Would be less bloat in that as well plus a whole lot easier on your body.

If you haven't figured out by now...I'm more of an advocate for getting more with less....and making sure the things you do now dont bite you later in life. Just think of me as being here to offer "fatherly" advice. I'm 44 years old....and seen way too many ruin there life doing things without knoing what is going on in your body.

That's why I recommend getting bloodwork during your cycle. You know what your bloodwork looks like after you've come off...and cleaned things up....but that's not when most of the damage is being done.

I'm a big believer in TRT for life at the proper dose....along with a small amount of gh (2-3iu's) for anti-aging purposes......and occasional blasts where you get in and get out quickly are of the most beneficial/least impactfull for your body and health.

Keep us updated!

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Absolutely agree. I never did Caber or prami I'm going to order some today just in case which I should of had on hand already. From what I know prami is cheaper but that's not the issue heard prami is harsher on the body and makes people feel like shit then Caber. Which one you prefer if you had to choose? Thanks

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Arrow 02-18-2018, 06:50 PM

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Absolutely agree. I never did Caber or prami I'm going to order some today just in case which I should of had on hand already. From what I know prami is cheaper but that's not the issue heard prami is harsher on the body and makes people feel like shit then Caber. Which one you prefer if you had to choose? Thanks

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If you run the PRAMI be sure you start out with the lowest minimum dose to see how you tolerate it. CABER works well for me, 1/2mg 2 x per week.
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