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coming completely off vs cruising on trt dose
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BIG D
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Question coming completely off vs cruising on trt dose - 01-24-2014, 08:15 AM

the general consensus seems to be that cruising(even for younger guys) is better in the long run if you choose to use aas for an extended period of time. when i say cruise, to me, thats a trt dose, not 500mg test. i must say i agree, and why put your body through the highs and lows of coming off/pct if you plan to go back on in say 4-6 months? however lately ive been reading more ppl who actually just come off cold turkey to give their body a rest. they make some good points as well. so whats your take here?

Last edited by BIG D; 01-24-2014 at 08:19 AM.
   
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LastChance
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01-24-2014, 08:35 AM

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The Grim Repper
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01-24-2014, 10:32 AM

I can only offer my personal experience:

Last streak of being on was 9 months, no breaks, fairly heavy dosages (for me) at some points. Came off completely doing a PCT (Scally - google it) and 10 weeks after coming off (2 weeks after PCT) I got blood work done. HPTA was completely shut down.
Here's the strange part: I felt better, much stronger and started to gain strength and size again at a quick rate. I was eating less food but using more of it. I stayed lean and had NO crash at all. Even shut down!

How shut down? Test -77, e2-6.6, LH <0.1, FSH <0.2.

So, I did another PCT in the hope of recovering (I am 42 after all - I may be screwed, LOL) and as of last week (19 weeks after complete cessation of the compounds), my test is at the low end of the normal range, FSH and LH are normal and estrogen is right in range. If low end of the range is my 'normal' then I'm good, I think normal for me is slightly higher, but that will take time to get back to that level.
This is why I've been in no rush to jump into use again, I'm growing almost better than I was on - actually in some ways definitely better! I know, makes NO sense, but it's 100% true. People have asked me what I'm on lately and it's funny cause I can honestly say nothing.
My opinion is that I was suffering from an adrenal/hormonal situation. Burnout. I felt toxic, stagnant. I had very mild testicular atrophy (used hcg on cycle to help with that), but libido although slightly repressed was still ok - things were working just fine. Shut down! But overall, the drugs stopped working for me.
Even if you are a competitive bodybuilder, it's my opinion that you should come off completely for certain periods. Will you recover? Who knows. Is that your goal? Will you crash? It's very likely you will, but I'm proof I didn't as are some other long time experienced users I am friends with who after years of continuous use have come off and been pleasantly surprised that we didn't - we felt better!
I think if you're off for 6 months, eat well but less rigidly, rest more (like 2-3 days between training), train less (3 days a week max) with less pressure on yourself and learn to enjoy it - really just enjoy it - you'll gain, improve in many aspects so if and when you decide to go back on, your receptors will be fresh and you'll be primed to utilize those compounds and more food better than before.

Just my .02


Grim


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"How long should I be resting between sets?"
"Well, if we're talking, you should go again."


"To take a trivial example, which of us ever undertakes laborious physical exercise, except to obtain some advantage from it? But who has any right to find fault with a man who chooses to enjoy a pleasure that has no annoying consequences, or one who avoids a pain that produces no resultant pleasure?"

Last edited by The Grim Repper; 01-24-2014 at 10:36 AM.
   
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joshck
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01-24-2014, 10:37 AM

Well said
   
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The Grim Repper
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01-24-2014, 11:51 AM

I just want to add, coming off allows you to get blood work done and getting a CBC (complete blood count) and chemistry panel lets you make sure your liver and kidneys are working well too. An ACCURATE assessment of overall health. This is crucial. Many coaches/gurus demand blood work before they'll work with you. Pros get blood work, you're no different. There's life after bodybuilding.
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"How long should I be resting between sets?"
"Well, if we're talking, you should go again."


"To take a trivial example, which of us ever undertakes laborious physical exercise, except to obtain some advantage from it? But who has any right to find fault with a man who chooses to enjoy a pleasure that has no annoying consequences, or one who avoids a pain that produces no resultant pleasure?"
   
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turbobusa
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01-24-2014, 11:57 AM

No I don't agree with young guys doing blast/cruise. Best used as plateau
breakers in early years . Cycle proper pct off time. like a ladder 3steps up 1 step back . steps up step back. ... Some of my favorite gains were on my own rebounded test. That is one time I will say test is test is test is not applicable.
I think your body's own test is better than any injected test there just is not as much. Like grim was saying some off time is always good in the long run.
Nothing better than making great natural gains between cycles.
To each hus own but i'd cycle on and off if I were in my 20s 30s for sure.
I still come off even trt with some pct even now.
T




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BIG D
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01-24-2014, 12:50 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbobusa View Post
No I don't agree with young guys doing blast/cruise. Best used as plateau
breakers in early years . Cycle proper pct off time. like a ladder 3steps up 1 step back . steps up step back. ... Some of my favorite gains were on my own rebounded test. That is one time I will say test is test is test is not applicable.
I think your body's own test is better than any injected test there just is not as much. Like grim was saying some off time is always good in the long run.
Nothing better than making great natural gains between cycles.
To each hus own but i'd cycle on and off if I were in my 20s 30s for sure.
I still come off even trt with some pct even now.
T
What type of pct would you recommend? What about just dropping cold turkey like they did back in the day , that's another option...
   
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BigBob
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01-24-2014, 03:25 PM

I agree with what Grim said. Its good to let the body do its thing. As for cold turkey: its is harder and its a real mind fuck but its like giving up carbs for 12 weeks. Hard but doable. Like Grim says don't put too much pressure on yourself. More rest and recovery.
And Turbo is right on. Cruising is just an excuse to stay on.
   
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BIG D
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01-24-2014, 04:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBob View Post
I agree with what Grim said. Its good to let the body do its thing. As for cold turkey: its is harder and its a real mind fuck but its like giving up carbs for 12 weeks. Hard but doable. Like Grim says don't put too much pressure on yourself. More rest and recovery.
And Turbo is right on. Cruising is just an excuse to stay on.
a cruise to me is trt doses tho, not 300-500mg test....
   
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BigBob
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01-24-2014, 06:39 PM

Cool. Some people mix the two up
   
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killswitch604
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01-28-2014, 07:40 AM

When I was younger I could come off completely and be just fine for quite a while, but now I find that I need a small dose of Test. I agree that coming off everything for at least a while is a good thing for blood work, but there will come a time when TRT doses will become a part of your permanent lifestyle, whether between cycles or not.
   
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BIG D
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01-29-2014, 07:34 AM

Good responses thus far. I still gotta agree that cruising at a true TRT level is healthier than coming off completely and crashing test levels. Low test has an abundance of sides including depression , ED, loss of muscle and strength, fat gain, loss of energy, decline in bone density just to name some.

Last edited by BIG D; 01-29-2014 at 07:48 AM.
   
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Enigmatic707
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01-29-2014, 08:55 AM

Last time I came off completely without proper pct it was a disaster- probably gained 20lbs of fat and lost 20 lbs of muscle..

Never again!
   
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t.c.jones
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01-29-2014, 09:23 AM

Every one is different. I blast and cruise. When I come off completely I feel like crap. So I Keep my diet strict and use the necessary supplements (in high doses) to keep me healthy. You will be surprised what a good Nutritionist will do for you.
   
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