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Go Back   Anabolic Steroids Discussion and Bodybuilding Forum > Diet, Nutrition & Supps Section > Diet, Nutrition & Supplements Discussion

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gakic?
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juicinjay
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gakic? - 10-26-2005, 12:17 PM

has anyone tried muscletechs new gakic supplement? I just picked up a bottle. The guy at the counter says it really does work immediately after the first dose. His strength went up by 20% the first day
   
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max lift
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10-26-2005, 01:50 PM

I have not but I would question 20% sounds like a sales line , 20% is a huge gain if you think about it it you bench 200lbs one day take this stuff and bench 240 the next screw roids just pass the gakic.
   
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JoshF56
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10-26-2005, 01:56 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by max lift
I have not but I would question 20% sounds like a sales line , 20% is a huge gain if you think about it it you bench 200lbs one day take this stuff and bench 240 the next screw roids just pass the gakic.
i agree, what store did you buy it from? i used to manage a GNC and would tell people things like that all the time just to get them to buy things, especially the teenagers who dont know anything about what they are buying.
   
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pincrusher
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10-26-2005, 02:15 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by juicinjay
has anyone tried muscletechs new gakic supplement? I just picked up a bottle. The guy at the counter says it really does work immediately after the first dose. His strength went up by 20% the first day
2 things to ponder here:
1) how much of that gain is actually kept?
2) does the guy actually work out or was it just a sales pitch? since they only advertise a 10-15% gain why was his more?

i was told by the girl at the local gnc that the pill form was better than the powder which doesnt make sense to me cause the powder would get absorbed faster since there are no bimders that have to break down.
since this stuff is so new there are not that many regular guys or dolls who have used it and reported on how effective it is. the only info is what muscletech is advertising in all the magazines
you could quite easily do a study to show this stuff works when it doesnt. just have your case study go to the gym without having takin in a preworkout meal and write down the results and next time have him consume a preworkout meal along with the gakic and i guarantee his results will increase noticibly just because of the meal and not the supplement.
   
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healthfreak
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10-26-2005, 02:16 PM

most of muscle techs products are not any good.
   
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juicinjay
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10-26-2005, 05:51 PM

the guy that told me this was quite large and claimed to be a powerlifter. he said when they got the first shipment in it was gone in two hours. label claim is a 10.5% gain in strength immediately. He says feedback from people have shown more like 15 to 20%
   
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pincrusher
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10-26-2005, 05:55 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by juicinjay
the guy that told me this was quite large and claimed to be a powerlifter. he said when they got the first shipment in it was gone in two hours. label claim is a 10.5% gain in strength immediately. He says feedback from people have shown more like 15 to 20%
but the question that remains to be answered is, are the gains keepable or only while you take the product?
   
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heavy
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10-26-2005, 07:53 PM

Check this link out, it is a study on the ingredient of "Gakic". (glycine-argine--ketoisocaproic acid)


Here is a highlight;

"Compared with the sucrose placebo, GAKIC treatment did not increase peak power or fatigue index in repeated dynamic anaerobic cycling."


http://www.ms-se.com/pt/re/msse/fulltext.00005768-200305001-01482.htm;jsessionid=DgVvDIx0P0qvX0iM19Qdwr1J819uC bquhSsV2eAR1HUsLjnWpLIQ!-2035160892!-949856144!9001!-1?index=1&database=ppvovft&results=1&count=10&searchid=1&nav=search

I wouldn't waste a CENT on this, or any other Muscletech TRASH.
   
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oakraider1
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10-27-2005, 08:11 AM

I think they spent more money on advertising and the star lineup then on the product. What I learned over the years is if its sounds to good to be true it usually is..
   
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max lift
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10-27-2005, 09:26 AM

I think that the best money spent is on protein, creatine and food, cant go wrong with the basics
   
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Gakic beneficial?
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stealthmeister
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Wink Gakic beneficial? - 10-27-2005, 11:03 AM

Re: Gakic........maybe better to call it Gimmik.

The 10 or more % gain in strength quoted likely comes from a study in Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2000 Dec;32(12):2102-8 entitled "High-intensity dynamic human muscle performance enhanced by a metabolic intervention". They found Overall gain in total muscle work attributable to GAKIC was 10.5 +/- 0.8% greater than control, sustained for at least 15 min. After 24 h, both GAKIC and control concentric forces returned to the same absolute values (P > 0.05). They concluded "compared with isocaloric carbohydrate, oral GAKIC treatment increased muscle torque and work sustained during intense acute anaerobic dynamic exercise; additionally, it increased overall muscle performance by delaying muscle fatigue during the early phases of anaerobic dynamic exercise". Take note though that there were only 13 patients in this study and that strength returned to being not-different from control at 24 hrs. Suggests to me no real muscle change or gain. I wonder if caffeine or ephedrine would give you a similar short-term boost in exertion with similar "strength gains". Hard to prove much with only 13 patients. Surprised it got published. You always have to look at who sponsors these papers too and if there is financial incentive to show a benefit. Also, remember that negative (no benefit) studies are less likely to get published, thus may also bias positive reports.

Heavy's quote / ref is from: Medicine & Science in Sports & Exercise: Volume 35(5) Supplement 1 May 2003 p S268
THE EFFECTS OF GLYCINE-ARGINE--KETOISOCAPROIC ACID ON REPEATED SETS OF ANAEROBIC CYCLING. They used only 10 subjects and found no benefit. Very interestingly, they re-worked their data (from their whopping sample of 10 patients) and published the following in 2004: Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2004 Apr;36(4):583-7 Glycine-arginine-alpha-ketoisocaproic acid improves performance of repeated cycling sprints that concluded "these data support an ergogenic effect of GAKIC for attenuating the decline in mean power during repeated bouts of supramaximal exercise". Nothing like re-working the numbers to make them say what you want them to say. What a bunch of bullshit!!

As they say, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. This is almost certainly one of those cases. Many, many supplements are a total waste of cash and risk side effects. I would suggest thoroughly reviewing them before use. Even things that have a huge following and market (like creatine) have had many, many papers written on them to show a modest benefit. But at least the data is there and you can make some concrete decisions about use. Compare that with a few small and poor studies in one type of setting (cycling sprints) on record for things like Gakic and I think you'd be crazy to waste your time and money on it until far more research has been done. Train hard, eat right, and sleep....that's gonna give you more benefit than 99% of the supplements out there. If you really need the gains, go with something undisputed, like AAS. Even in modest doses, you'd be likely to see more gains than the highest doses of questionable supplements. Not that I'm encouraging AAS use

That's my 2 cents
   
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pincrusher
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10-29-2005, 10:13 AM

for the cost of gakic you would be better off getting some anavar powder and making your own oral suspension from it cause your gains would be more permanant than from the gakic.
   
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RAMROD
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10-31-2005, 07:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by healthfreak
most of muscle techs products are not any good.
I would have to agree 100%. Just a big marketing scam. their products are way over priced and dont do shit.
   
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