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tordon
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glucophage - 02-21-2007, 05:53 AM

ive been reading up on glucophage, it seems it can lower natural test, atleast thats what the study sugested even though the amount of people in the test was rather low, like 12 I think, so the results kind of seemed inacurate to start with.....but I have a few questions I will post here as well as pro.mus...The test sugested that if liver damage was already a problem, glucophage could cause acidosis, so is glucophage hep toxic? and if so to what degree, like in comparison to an 17 A oral like dbol?, also since it can lower natural test, is it advisable to use off cycle?..does anyone know of anybody who has used it off cycle?...
I am just about ready to go another round with AS, but am trying to find a way to not lose as many gains durring post cycle, I don't trust myself enough yet with insulin and am not knowlagable enough about things like igf yet, although I am working on getting to that point......

thanx....


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mike1991
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02-21-2007, 06:09 AM

Dude glucophage is an oral diabetes medicine and some people have developed a life-threatening condition called lactic acidosis while taking Glucophage. Get emergency medical help if you have any of these symptoms of lactic acidosis: weakness, increasing sleepiness, slow heart rate, cold feeling, muscle pain, shortness of breath, stomach pain, feeling light-headed, and fainting. Do not use Glucophage if you have kidney disease or congestive heart failure, or if you are in a state of diabetic ketoacidosis.
   
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tordon
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02-21-2007, 09:29 AM

Zitat:
Zitat von mike1991
Dude glucophage is an oral diabetes medicine and some people have developed a life-threatening condition called lactic acidosis while taking Glucophage. Get emergency medical help if you have any of these symptoms of lactic acidosis: weakness, increasing sleepiness, slow heart rate, cold feeling, muscle pain, shortness of breath, stomach pain, feeling light-headed, and fainting. Do not use Glucophage if you have kidney disease or congestive heart failure, or if you are in a state of diabetic ketoacidosis.
thank you for your concern mike, I know you are a very knowlegable man, I have been reserching this stuff for a week now...
yes I relize what the med is for and what it can cause mike, the lactic acidosis is only if you have already got liver problems from what ive read, and I am aware of the symtoms of it, my mother my sister and even my dog are on this stuff perscribed by a doctor, many bodybuilders swear by this stuff as well... I was just simply wondered if it was hep toxic, if no liver problems were present, and if any bodybuilders take this stuff off cycle.......


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mike1991
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02-21-2007, 02:30 PM

The lactic acidosis is only a problem with people who already have a coexisting contion such as kidney problems, CHF (congested heart failure), and DKA. But that doesn't mean if you do have any of these conditions that will get lactiic acidosis, it just means that you will have a greater risk. So educate me and tell me why healthy guys like yourself would be taking this. I'm trying to think about the pros of it, but I can't.
   
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mike1991
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02-21-2007, 02:31 PM

Zitat:
Zitat von tordon
I was just simply wondered if it was hep toxic, if no liver problems were present

Keine
   
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tordon
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02-22-2007, 07:16 AM

i'm not taking it, i'm simply reserching it, I also reserch slin hgh and Igf and syntherol and much more, i'm just trying to learn everything I can bro,
I found on pro muscle, people who are not resdy to take the plunge to slin are doing this stuff, on anabolex as well........check this link out dude...

http://www.professionalmuscle.com/fo...ight=metformin


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mike1991
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02-22-2007, 08:08 AM

I read the posts and I'm not even going to recommand how you should use it. Due to the fact, I don't approve of it. As with insulin, I use to use it and when I used my regular dose when I was on AAS it put me in the hospital for a few days. Contary what people say that insulin will kill you is true, but it is a long process. What will happen is you will starve your brain of glucose and this is how you slip into a coma after you have a seizure depend how low your glucose went. I never meet anybody who died suddenly from insulin, I have meet people who have been remove from life support because they became brain dead form using too much insulin. Taking an oral diabetic medication is safer then regular or humolog insulin, but the risk is still there. If you do use it, don't be a retard like one guy said that he was taking 1500mg per day. If you screw up you may not get another second chance.
   
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shanetuff
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02-23-2007, 01:40 AM

Listen to Mike, he knows his shit about Insulin.

What are you looking for the glucophage to do. Are you wanting its anabolic effects?

If your looking for that, get on groth and double all your anabolics. When you start pissing blood, back off a little on the orals. Tan alot so you wont look so yellow.

Dude, its hard core shit. Do your home work first. Let use know what you do.

Mike, what do you think of metformin? I know guys, other than my old man, who use it all year long.


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mike1991
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02-23-2007, 02:21 AM

Shane, Glucophage and metformin is one in the same. Glucophage is the brand name while its generic name is metformin. Other such as Riomet, Fortamet, and glumetza and probably more that I can’t think of right now are the same as glucophage. The generic names for all of these are metformin hydrochloride. The reason why the brand name is different on all of them is because they are manufactured by different drugs companies. Your best bet would be to talk to other who is using this. Not any Joe blow either. People who are very experience by the means of actually taking it. Anytime you use an antidiabetic agent there are risks. Just consume a lot of short and long acting carbs before you take it. Preferably like 100 grams of carbs. I don’t have my palm pilot on me so I can’t tell you the half life. But I will post that tomorrow after I get home from work.
   
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mike1991
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02-23-2007, 02:21 AM

Shane, Glucophage and metformin is one in the same. Glucophage is the brand name while its generic name is metformin. Other such as Riomet, Fortamet, and glumetza and probably more that I can’t think of right now are the same as glucophage. The generic names for all of these are metformin hydrochloride. The reason why the brand name is different on all of them is because they are manufactured by different drugs companies. Your best bet would be to talk to other who is using this. Not any Joe blow either. People who are very experience by the means of actually taking it. Anytime you use an antidiabetic agent there are risks. Just consume a lot of short and long acting carbs before you take it. Preferably like 100 grams of carbs. I don’t have my palm pilot on me so I can’t tell you the half life. But I will post that tomorrow after I get home from work.
   
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tordon
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02-23-2007, 02:50 AM

my dogs diabetic, my mom is a mild diabetic, I can see the doc putting her on it, but my sis ins't to my knowlage, why the hell would he sugest she use it too, blows my mind, all they know about the stuff is to take it after breakfast, they knew nothing about the 100grams of carbs stuff til i informed them a few days ago after doing my own reserch, they also were unaware of the problems with b12 absorbsion associated with metformin , and my mom has problems with anemia and has to get regular b12 inj. what is your opinion in this case mike?.. WTF, like I said, I am doing my homework and may never use the stuff, but I do want to know everything I can, about every thing I can..esspecially when family members are involved..I appreciate your experience in this matter mike, I'm not one of those guys you see on forums who is just gonna try somthing I heard about from some guy, I do a mountain of reserch before i get into anything, for that matter there are many AS's i stay clear from as well, but this does not mean I don't look into them, or even resech them with no intention of ever going there........


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tordon
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02-23-2007, 03:14 AM

Zitat:
Zitat von shanetuff
Listen to Mike, he knows his shit about Insulin..
I know mike knows his shit buddy, I respect "his" opinion...

Zitat:
Zitat von shanetuff
What are you looking for the glucophage to do. Are you wanting its anabolic effects?..
as far as I know it isn't anabolic, it sensititizes insulin receptors, and blocks glucose in the intestines...

Zitat:
Zitat von shanetuff
If your looking for that, get on groth and double all your anabolics. When you start pissing blood, back off a little on the orals. Tan alot so you wont look so yellow.?..
I'm not just some dumb kid who found a forum and decided to juice up buddy, ive been doing as cycles for years, and safely, I may add.....and have done more reserch on them than most people I know who use....as far as GH it aint worth the cash for the results a guy gets for bulking puposes, and is only practical for fat loss IMO and I have no intention of ever using it anyways.....and as far as the rest of that comment is concerned.......YOU FIRST..... and you can keep me posted...


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Zuletzt bearbeitet von tordon; 02-23-2007 an 03:31 UHR.
   
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mike1991
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02-23-2007, 04:12 AM

You put people on glucophage as monotherapy, are indicated as an adjunct to diet and exercise to improve glycemic control in patients with type 2 diabetes. Are you sure your sis isn’t a diabtic ? Adults in general, clinically significant responses are not seen at doses below 1500 mg per day. However, a lower recommended starting dose and gradually increased dosage is advised to minimize gastrointestinal symptoms.
The usual starting dose of glucophage is 500 mg twice a day or 850 mg once a day, given with meals. Dosage increases should be made in increments of 500 mg weekly or 850 mg every 2 weeks, up to a total of 2000 mg per day, given in divided doses. Patients can also be titrated from 500 mg twice a day to 850 mg twice a day after 2 weeks. For those patients requiring additional glycemic control, glucophage may be given to a maximum daily dose of 2550 mg per day. Doses above 2000 mg may be better tolerated given three times a day with meals. You would never had to go at these dosages due to the fact, we are not diabetics. Diabetes mellitus (DM) is a group of metabolic diseases characterized by high blood sugar levels, which result from defects in insulin secretion, or action, or both. We do not have this problem.
With anemias,a decrease to subnormal levels of previously normal serum Vitamin B12 levels, without clinical manifestations is very low when taking glucophage. However, measurement of hematologic parameters on an annual basis is the standard in patients on glucophage. Certain individuals with inadequate Vitamin B12 appear to be predisposed to developing subnormal Vitamin B12 levels. In these patients, routine serum Vitamin B12 measurements at two- to three-year intervals may be useful.

Tordon, I wasn’t replying anything negative about you in regards to taking glucophage. I’m also very glad you research things before trying them. As with glucophage, I would recommend that you stay away from taking this now. I only recommend this due to the fact; you have DM that runs in your family. If your MD is recommending that your sis be put on it, then her A1C which is a test that can measure your glucose during the last three months must be high. Your MD will not put her on glucophage unless she is DX with DM. If this is the case and I hate to say it, but you are running a very high risk of developing DM in the future. Also, if you are genetically predisaposed to DM, taking insulin or any oral anti-diabetic medications may actually increase your risk more. I have no proof that it may and I doubt I can go through any journal to see if any studies exist. Since a study like that would be unethical.
   
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mike1991
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02-23-2007, 04:21 AM

Zitat:
Zitat von tordon
I know mike knows his shit buddy, I respect "his" opinion...
I agree I know my stiff with the AAS that are used in the medical field, like Deca and test. But with all of the other AAS I don't know that much, but I always ask and wait until a large amount of people respond before making a conclusion. I am far from being anybody that knows his shit. Until Congress reverse the AAS issue. Then and maybe then, real textbooks and courses on AAS can be achieved. However, it probably will only happen if it does when I'm to old to give a damn. Test, I will take until I die if I am lifting or not.
   
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mike1991
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02-23-2007, 04:30 AM

[QUOTE=tordon]my mom is a mild diabetic, all they know about the stuff is to take it after breakfast, they knew nothing about the 100grams of carbs stuff QUOTE]

Your mom does not need 100 grams of carbs after she takes her med. Remember, we do not have a problem when our glucose get to high. Our body corrects that. Your mother do have a problem with the absence or insufficient production of insulin.
   
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tordon
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02-23-2007, 04:58 AM

I'm sure my sis isn't diabetic, at most shes slightly hypoglycemic, I'm not even sure the doc did any tests on her for it, he just sugested it would't hurt her to take it as well as she has low energy, I will talk with her in the morning and find out for sure, as for my mother she is only slightly diabetic, I'm getting worried about them now, and the Doctors dessision in this matter, should they have a glucosameter aswell?....the whole thing is hush hush around here as the doc origanally gave my mom the script for her dog, if you can belive that, as he is the only one who is for sure diabetic , my mom couldn't afford it from the vet and is on a plan, went crying to the doc and he gave her a big script for the stuff on the down low, next thing I know everybody over there is on it, I'm gonna find out just what tests were performed and on whom, but like I said I know my sis isn't diabetic, and was told to take the stuff.....


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tordon
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02-23-2007, 05:02 AM

Zitat:
Zitat von mike1991
Test, I will take until I die if I am lifting or not.
do you take test depot year round, as HRT....


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tordon
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02-23-2007, 05:07 AM

[QUOTE=mike1991] clinically significant responses are not seen at doses below 1500 mg per day. QUOTE]

both of them are on no more than 500mg/day taken in the morning


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mike1991
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02-23-2007, 05:12 AM

Dude, what you said is scary. I would get a new MD or better yet find a Nurse Practitioner that specialize in DM. Your sister wouldn’t be on glucophage if she has low energy. That would make it worst. More likely she has anemia and almost every girl has an iron related anemia unless they are taking supplements due to there menstrual cycle. Its just common knowledge. Yes she needs an accu-chek machine or a glucose machine what ever you want to call it. How can you adjust her dose if she doesn’t now what her glucose is?
   
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mike1991
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02-23-2007, 05:14 AM

Zitat:
Zitat von tordon
do you take test depot year round, as HRT....

Damn I'm not that old. I believe in HRT and when I am old enough I plan on being on it year around.
   
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